After Wednesday night’s light attendance, although great speakers, I decided to treat myself to the debate for Undecided voters in Dumbarton.
This looked a lot more promising in numbers. There must have been about a hundred in the hall and the debate got under way. We had 4 speakers. Elspeth Crockett, a retired school teacher led the charge with an extremely enthusiastic and passionate plead for voters. She touched on all the usual positives but injected her own brand of enthusiasm that is hard to resist. Who would have thought a school teacher would know more about our oil reserves than all the ‘brains’ of the Better Together elite – but there you are. Just show the extent to which the YES ‘rank and file’ and our aficionados have informed themselves for the ‘big’ debate. Some may say, they have a tiger by the tale!
Ian MacDougall from Business for Scotland took up the baton. Ian is a Chartered Accountant, a self made man from Greenock with a keen entrepreneurial spirit, literally, as he owns a whisky company – top that. Ian scotched many of the myths that are being put about in terms of numbers. He used his own journey to explain the topic of the evening – YES WE CAN. Ian likened his size and weight (soaken wet) to a Scotland, compact but punching well above its weight. You don’t need height to walk tall.
Feargal Dalton, retired Lieutenant Commander Navy Submarines, carried on the evenings debate with his fascinating journey to YES which began back in Ireland where he had first hand experience of Ireland’s journey. Along the way he has encountered a number of ‘fearties’ who doubted Ireland’s ability to go it alone. This made him even more determined. He swept aside the shared currency issue from Ireland’s perspective where the UK promoted a shared currency? I liked the thought of Feargal’s ‘fearties’. He joined the navy taking up a position in the north of Scotland then ‘landing’ in the nuclear base at Faslane with hands-on command experience of Trident. As the expert in the room, and certainly beyond, Feargal made the point strongly that Trident was nothing if not a huge bargaining chip.
Carol Fox is a lawyer who like to ‘buck the establishment’. She was speaking on behalf of Women for Independence and brought a ‘now familiar’ perspective to the debate. She made the very pertinent point that the referendum will be won or lost – but probably won by the women of Scotland. Carol extolled some of the positive aspects of remaining in the EU especially in relation to her particular specialism, Human Rights and Employment Law.
However, the panel were unanimous in explaining that many of the ‘critical questions’ raised by Better Together such as the EU, Trident and shared currency were distractions from the main question. A YES vote was about our future, our children’s future and our determination to make our own decisions for our nation and to build a fairer and more equal nation. The EU, Currency and Trident were matters that would be sorted out by the duly elected Government of Free Scotland; and that may not be SNP. However, the decisions would be made by Scots, with Scots and for Scots.
The questions came on and the gloves came off.
One chap at the front made a fascinating point that resonated around the room like a waft of lavender. He was an Irishman and he explained that Ireland grabbed it’s independence and made a go of it; he felt they were slightly ahead of Scotland in that they were a people ‘content in their own skin’. Scotland still had to get there – but they were on the journey and getting there.
A women opened the questions with a concern for Carol about mental health provisions in an independent Scotland. Carol explained that her field was ‘social justice’ so she was not best qualified to comment on such a sensitive subject. I’m not sure the woman was placated.
My word to the wise. Mental health issues are extremely important to those most affected. I believe and hope that a country on a mission to create a fairer and more equal society would endeavour to do better than the current situation. Witness the current situation and I speak from twenty odd years living and working in the City of London. Scots Health provisions are far fairer than the rUK. Even the simple things; we don’t pay for prescriptions, we can park at our hospitals and we get to see our GP’s quicker. I have sat in A & E at the Royal London where a 7 hour wait is far from unusual, you struggle for a seat in the foyer and there are 200 ahead of you – and forget parking – YOU CAN’T and if you can, it’s a King’s ransom!
Another women in the audience was concerned about Scotland wresting control from Westminster then handing it over to the EU. There was a bit of dialogue back and forth. She was not happy with the answers she was getting that seemed to paint an all too rosy picture of the EU. I don’t think she was convinced – and I sympathised with her frustration – I don’t think she got a good response. From my perspective there were two glaring omissions. First of all the EU is an extremely costly members club. It is possible to trade with the EU paying a premium that opens up their markets. The second point would be our ability to negotiate trade deals with the vastly expanding world markets such as Mexico, Brazil, India, Russia, China to name but a few. Such negotiations cannot happen as a member of the EU. However, I don’t believe this is a question for the referendum, it a question for the Free Scotland Government.
A well informed young lady in the audience explained some of the legalities of the EU constitution and the ability to adapt legal provisions that conflict, especially with your culture; albeit not a straightforward process. She also explained the the EU and the European Court of Human Rights were not the same thing and exiting the EU did not mean withdrawing from the ECHR.
A group from Aggreko were in the hall. One very vocal guy explained ( was that an explanation? might have been an instruction) that being in the EU was essential for global players such as Aggreko who bring valuable work to the area. We all sat to attention.
Another girl from Aggreka sited European Law as it applies to License fees and why it may be a breach of our Human Rights. She explained that the BBC was not acting in the interests of their viewers but were transfixed on their £300 Million pay.
I always like to get my tuppence halfpenny in and made a couple of comments. I explained that Scotland is sitting on around £1.5 Trillion of oil. Westminster is sitting on £1.5 Trillion of debt – of course we are Better Together. There was a deadly silence at the mention of Better Together. Then the sarcasm moved around the room like a Mexican wave and came to a nervous applause – still, we got there. On a more serious note I explained, in response to an earlier comment, that Scotland had NEVER held Westminster to account. You hold Governments to account through the ballot box. With a population outnumbered 11:1 by the incumbent Government, we can never hold that Government to account. Not so in an independent Scotland where the people can clearly hold THEIR Government to account.
My ‘elephant in the room’ – don’t you just hate that expression – at the Dumbarton debate is this:
Dumbarton has always been a staunch Labour town. From the platform and the audience and if there was a stray dug in the room they were all unanimous in their condemnation of the Scottish Labour Party who had betrayed the people of the town and the people of their own country by getting into bed with their arch enemies to defeat their fellow country(wo)men in their quest for self-determination. And this has been done for pure self interest and a pathological pursuit of a Westminster career – shame on all of them – and god bless Labour for Indy who have stood apart from them. In Labour for Indy I think we are seeing the rebirth of the real Scottish Labour Movement – righting the wrongs of ‘New Labour’ and re-discovering socialism.